Ed Catmull, co-founder of Pixar and former president of Disney Animation, was on the David Senra podcast and I quite enjoyed the interview.
(If you like the interview, you should read his book.)
Ed talks about what he considered his job to be: get the dynamics right for groups of people working together.
To do this, he would pull people out of meetings, make groups smaller, make them bigger, just constantly work on fine-tuning getting the right people together at the right time with the right feedback (without ego).
Granted he didnât always do it, but that was his goal. He says:
This is so important to get [these group dynamics right] because this is what our product is based on: getting this group of people to work well together. So paying attention to the dynamics of the room is the job. Theyâre the ones making the movies. Iâm not making the movie. Iâm just trying to get them to work well together.
When Steve Jobs came to Ed and essentially said, âWeâre gonna bet everything at Pixar on Toy Story, and the same week that Toy Story is released in theaters weâre gonna IPO.â What did Ed think?
I thought it was crazy [laugh] Iâve learned a lot in this process. He was right.
I love this frank exchange and Edâs ability to go from âI thought he was crazyâ to âI learnedâ.
In a creative endeavor, where so many earlier iterations suck, how do you gauge whether you should keep going? Because to keep going can make you seem a tad crazy, e.g. âThis sucks â letâs keep going!â
So how do you know whether you should keep investing in it? Edâs answer:
Whatâs your basis for proceeding? For me, the basis was: whatâs the spirit of the team? Because we all know it [sucks] but if theyâre all working together â theyâre laughing, and [doing things] together â then you say, âLetâs keep going. Letâs keep trying to solve it.â
I love this. He didnât say, âYou open a spreadsheet and do a cost analysis.â He said he looks at the spirit of the people working on it.
It really backs up what he said his job is: find and help groups of people work together. His attitude seems to be: a group of people with the right dynamics can solve anything.
Ed talks about Pixarâs willingness to take on hard problems because they believed a hard problem led to better outcomes (because few others were willing to do the hard work):
A hard problem is more likely to lead to an interesting film. If itâs easy, then itâs more derivative.
You know how to write a script, you know what the three-act structure is, you know all these elements of storytelling, and you put together all the pieces and you got a story. Is it a great story? Is it emotional? Sometimes yes, sometimes no [âŚ]
Itâs fairly easy to come up with something that is mediocre â and itâs cheaper too.
If you take on hard things then you need to spend more time trying to figure out how to be different in what youâre doing. So if you take on a hard problem and you just keep pushing at it, then the fact that it was hard is what is going to make it different.
Stated again for emphasis: âthe fact that it was hard is what is going to make it differentâ.
And itâs the execution thatâs hard, not having the idea:
If youâre going to make a movie about a rat that likes to cook, that is not a slam dunk.
A lot of people want to keep their projects secret, but this is one where you could tell everybody: âWeâre going to make a movie about a rat that cooks!â
His point being: nobody can steal that idea and make it good. Execution is everything there. And if you look at it and say, âWell thatâs too hard. How could you make a film about a rat that likes to cook?â Youâre skirting the hard work, which is exactly what is going to make you different.
Donât skirt the hard thing. If you do something thatâs hard, thatâs the differentiation.
Lastly: I love Edâs perspective on mission statements:
The reason [we never had a mission statement] is because a mission statement is an answer, when typically we should always be asking questions, like âWhat are we doing?â
His point being: if somebody asks âWhat are we doing?â and you immediately go back to the mission statement and say, âOh, well weâre doing thisâ thatâs not good. Itâs better to always be questioning. âAre we doing the right thing? Are we going in the right direction?â You should always be wrestling with those questions.
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